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Post by nukesnipe on Sept 11, 2015 15:10:16 GMT -5
Bret,
How the downloads are printed is up to the customer. You can express your intent, but it's really up to the customer. For instance, most paper building vendors will recommend printing on 110# cardstock, but there's no reason you couldn't print on regular paper and glue it to foam board.
I meant to mention in my previous post that I've seen everything as separate files (rules, counters, maps) or all as one big pdf, or a combination.
In either case, I'd print the rules on plain paper and the maps/counters on card stock.
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Post by darkpumpkin on Sept 11, 2015 20:53:30 GMT -5
For our fantasy line, the largest, that might be too large for a bundle? Do you have a feel for the size of the bundle (3-6 games?) and the expected discount (15%?)? That sounds about right. 15-20% discount, and 4-5 games. You could split up the LAW modules into several sets, maybe with each set of modules offering a path from 32 point characters up to the higher point parties. Do you have a feel how much should be previewable? 10% (3-4 pages of our average module)? Would 3-4 pages of one of our modules actually convey information? As everything is broken up into non-linear paragraphs, would the average buyer understand? Is there a different format of a preview we should consider? I think up to 8-10 pages might be better. So that they can get an idea of the actual adventure paragraph text rather than just previewing the rules pages. You might consider a low-res preview of the counters (obviously so it couldn't be printed out without purchase). I think the counters and map is a selling point and unique value so it should be made very apparent that these are provided. You do make it clear on the web page, however on RPGNow this is an unusual type of product so it needs to be very obvious. Would it actually be three files, including the tactical map? If we went with a greyscale option for the rules booklet, would that actually be 4 different files? If it is a two-page map, is that still one file or two? Yes, I misspoke. Three files - map, counters, and booklet. As Nukesnipe has said, there's no need to offer greyscale files, or specially formatted booklet printing files, etc. Most people can handle the printing issues themselves. Do you feel $10 is too much for 36 pages, 3 tactucal maps, and a full 8.5 by 11 inch page of counters? Sounds about right, especially with three maps. However, I know how easy it is to get slowed down by trying to add extra things to a project, like creating the new tactical maps. Personally I would just try to get the first modules up for sale without them. 18 modules x 2 extra maps for each = possibly weeks or months of delay. Or it would if it were me doing it. |
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Post by platimus on Sept 12, 2015 7:54:03 GMT -5
Yes! I have trouble putting my thoughts into words. Nukesnipe and Darkpumpkin have done it for me! Just a few things I hope I can add without screwing up:
Darkpumpkin's post alludes to this...include lo-res versions of the counters and map in the preview. Leave out the rules but provide links to the free download of the rules in the product description and in one of the preview pages.
I fully support DP's advice about not trying to add 'extras' yet. Just 'get'er done' and out the door first. The ball is easier to move once it is rolling.
I see no reason why the map(s) and counters would have to be in separate files. It could all be in one pdf. I'm thinking the map might be included twice: one large, 11x17 page with the whole, unbroken map and then again with the map broken into halves or two 8.5x11 pages. The second options is for me and others like me that lack the ability to print 11x17 stuff at home. Of course, I could create the second option myself through screen-grabs, photo-editing, or other digital kung-fu but it would seem wise to be accommodating in this area.
Of course, if it presents no problems or complications to setup 'in the store' as two or more separate files, you could still do that. I just worry about the possible customer confusion, questions/support nightmares, and dissatisfaction that might result from that. But I guess that could go either way and will happen to some degree anyway. The ball always hits some bumps when it starts rolling.
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Post by platimus on Sept 12, 2015 8:03:25 GMT -5
Roll the ball out slowly at first. Planning is great but imperfect. Being able to make course-corrections (responsiveness/improvisation) are just as important as planning.
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Post by sergey on Sept 13, 2015 18:19:52 GMT -5
$10 is a fair price for one book, countersheet and one to three maps. Yes. But it would be more appealing for me to have only 36-page book for, say, half of this price, i.e. $5. I could even promise not to share the english-language version! (On the other hand my opinion is not very representative - just to put my two cents.)
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Post by platimus on Sept 15, 2015 18:40:08 GMT -5
Going back to the bit about anyone having the ability to print color images/docs as gray-scale...
In my own experiments with creating maps, counters, etc. color choice can be tricky when you are trying design something in color but want to accommodate gray-scale printing. Some colors contrast against each other very well in color but look exactly the same when converted to gray-scale. I would 'proof-read' color maps, counters, etc. by converting them to b/w to test this before publishing the color version.
I have no artistic training, so maybe there are design principles taught to art students to avoid this sort of thing - making my recommendation seem foolish. So be it.
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Post by darkpumpkin on Sept 15, 2015 21:30:22 GMT -5
Off topic, but regarding printing out of counters...I bought the pocket reissue of the 1977 Ogre from Steve Jackson Games. The counters were awesome! Double-sided printing, the thick card die-cut just right. Just like microgames from back in the day, but better.
I wonder how SJG does that kind of specialised printing job, with the die-cutting. Is it in-house or are such facilities accessible to small publishers?
Anyway...
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Post by Lord Inar on Jan 11, 2016 18:50:04 GMT -5
I'm late to every party... Hey where's the food? Is this sushi fresh?
I buy a lot from RPGNow, etc.
Two comments on the price point.
1) a common price is half the printed price or just a little more.
Half of $13 is $6.50 which might be a little lower than you're willing to go.
2) You can price it close to what you want and never put it on sale (which is a viable approach), or you can price it a little higher and then occasionally include one in one of their site-wide sales. I don't know for sure, but if the discount is good enough, that might account for the bulk of your sales, so you don't want to make it too low.
Having the rules up there as separate free downloads can't hurt either.
Would you be using them for your printed versions as well? (I don't know if OneBookshelf does standalone cardstock. I know they do cards.) I haven't actually ordered anything POD from them, so I can't comment on the quality.
Sorry to sound like the low-balling cheapskate!
(My perspective comes from the fact that while the counters are nice, I do everything on my big Chessex mat with my 25-28mm figs, so I don't get as much value from the cardstock minis, except as a manifest for what minis I need to pull for the game.)
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Post by Lord Inar on Jan 11, 2016 18:54:17 GMT -5
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Post by darkpumpkin on Jan 21, 2016 22:35:29 GMT -5
Bret or George, PM me if you'd be interested in having some volunteer help putting up some pdf files on OneBookShelf. I have no special expertise except for having created some books in pdf and hardcopy on Lulu, but would be happy to help.
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Post by badpixie on Dec 9, 2016 19:48:18 GMT -5
My 2 pence (I'm British) worth.
I don't use the map or counters. What I do is go on a site I've created on roll 20, recreate the map electronically, and produce custom counters from the zillions of images available on google. Using the electronic dice roller on r20 as well, its basically all on my computer screen.
Referring to a pdf for the actual adventure would be a logical extension of this -and I'd likely download e copies of my existing ones as backups.
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Post by platimus on Dec 10, 2016 20:52:35 GMT -5
My 2 pence (I'm British) worth. I don't use the map or counters. What I do is go on a site I've created on roll 20, recreate the map electronically, and produce custom counters from the zillions of images available on google. Using the electronic dice roller on r20 as well, its basically all on my computer screen. Referring to a pdf for the actual adventure would be a logical extension of this -and I'd likely download e copies of my existing ones as backups. YES!!! I'd like to do something like that myself. However, I'd rather not recreate the map. I'd rather copy the map from the PDF, paste into an image file and upload to r20 or similar virtual-tabletop. I would probably do the same thing with the counters. Makes taking out and putting away my "toys" very quick and easy  Is there really any reason to leave the map and counters out of the PDF? Also, I'd be willing to re-buy the PDF versions of the adventures I already own (which is a lot of re-purchasing from my perspective). That said, I feel obliged to notify DCG that I have been postponing purchases until there are PDF versions or DCG makes an announcement that it is closing down. I'm also willing to pay the full price ($13) for those PDFs. |
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Is there really any reason to leave the map and counters out of the PDF?