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Post by mister frau blucher on Sept 12, 2017 22:49:57 GMT -5
Hey, friends, we have messed around with races several times over the years, and gotten a lot of feedback. Much of it is negative - and that is the nature of modifications to the old The Fantasy Trip ruleset - people have been modding it their way for 40 years now (yes, Melee and Wizard are that old), and most people that have been playing that long know what works in their campaigns, as well as having developed their own concepts of game design. So take this with a grain of salt. We might change it next year! We have had two major do-overs in the past, but this is how we are currently doing races. Maybe we'll do a couple of posts on the philosophy, maybe not. But the basic idea is to A) give each race a little bonus or unique incentive, and B) make characters a bit more interesting and versatile at low level. Humans: 8/8/8+8 points. 2 extra skill levels (at least 1 must be a Social skill). Dwarves: 9/8/8+8 points. Craft: Mining+1. All STR checks at +1. Elves: 7/9/9+8 points. Reveal Magic (as per spell). Non-mage elves may learn spells with 16xp; mage elves learn spells at 8xp. Tigrans: 8/8/8+8 points. Claws (as dagger); Stalker+1. Ursans: 13/7/6+5 points. Fur 1/0; Survival+1. Gnomes: 7/7/10+8 points. Invisibility (as per spell). Luprians: 8/10/6+8 points. +1 to Move; Tracker+1. Orcs: 9/6/6+8 points. Goblins: 7/7/7+11 points. For those who have some earlier adventures with race data in it, these are some big changes, but after being in business and playingg/playtesting for 11 years now, this is where we stand. This originally appeared in Ebon Rebirth. This definitely makes most starting characters more powerful, but given the nature of our adventures, that is not a bad thing! Feel free to mess around with this, and if you are inclined let us hear the lamentations!
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Post by jonathan1971 on Sept 16, 2017 10:24:32 GMT -5
So are halflings not a part of your universe? I ask cause the spreadsheet for character generation includes them.
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Post by platimus on Sept 20, 2017 20:22:29 GMT -5
So are halflings not a part of your universe? I ask cause the spreadsheet for character generation includes them. If Bret (or any other TFT-ish veteran) has a template for halflings like the ones above, I'd love to see it. However, I've always had the feeling that halflings aren't very popular in these circles. Here is what In the Labyrinth had to say about halflings: (I hope it's OK to copy/paste that here. If not, I'll gladly delete.) Some of that I really like. Some of that seems too complicated. Yet there are many things it doesn't address. I haven't playtested any of this but I've thought about it a lot over the few years I've been around here. Here's what I have scribbled-down in the back of my mind: (You might notice a theme) Create a halfling like a human character. Assign those skill points in a way that fits your concept of what halflings are like. Halflings always take half-damage due to their small size and hardiness. They can't use weapons of Heft greater than 10. Halflings have "Passive" and "Active" strength (ST). Passive ST is their normal ST (however many points you've put into their ST). Passive ST is used for determining what weapons they can effectively wield (below Heft 11), how much damage they can take, and for physical resistence checks (like vs poison, etc.) Active ST is their Passive ST divided by 2. This used for checks that require real muscle power like breaking down a door or pushing/pulling a boulder or something like that. Because of their small size, halflings can use their Passive ST when climbing. (For Grappling, well, there's a reason why I like to let ST or DX be used when making grappled attacks or trying to escape a grapple.)
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Post by araman on Sept 21, 2017 18:10:26 GMT -5
Well said.
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Post by platimus on Sept 22, 2017 21:48:20 GMT -5
If that refers to me, thanks. If not, I feel foolish My only concern is that "halflings take half-damage" may be too generous. I thought about countering it with "halflings always do half-damage" but I hope limiting their weapons to Heft < 11 provides enough balance. Still, a Cutlas type of blade (Heft 10) does 2d6-2. That seems a bit lethal in the hands of a character that only takes half-damage. I don't want to encourage marauding bands of hobbits I'm open to suggestions...
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Post by platimus on Sept 22, 2017 21:50:34 GMT -5
By the way, I meant to include this in my earlier post: Bret, I like those racial templates.
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Post by nukesnipe on Sept 22, 2017 22:37:21 GMT -5
Heroes and Otherworlds is about 99% directly compatible with LAW. In fact, Orcs of the High Mountains is included in the HOW rules as an introductory adventure.
HOW race states are:
Race/ST/DX/IQ/EN/Hero Points
Human/8/8/8/8/10
Elf/6/10/9/7/10
Dwarf/9/6/8/9/10
Halfling/6/9/8/9/10
In HOW, player characters have an attribute called "Endurance" from which damage is applied before being deducted from ST. In effect, EN is a damage soak. Hero points are points that can be distributed across the four attributes.
Non-player characters don't have the EN attribute.
As written, in HOW you do not improve your states. Instead, you improve your skill levels and apply modifiers if you try to perform a skill for which you lack the minimum attributes. There is a cap in skill improvement, but I can't remember what it is off the top of my head (+6?).
I look at HOW as "advanced" LAW, falling somewhere between LAW and TFT in complexity.
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Post by araman on Sept 27, 2017 8:09:13 GMT -5
Plat, it does refer to you.
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stevo
New Member
Posts: 5
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Post by stevo on Feb 4, 2018 11:02:44 GMT -5
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Post by mister frau blucher on Feb 4, 2018 17:01:20 GMT -5
Stevo,
Marc is Lord Inar, a very longtime friend of DCG! And all of humanity!
He has long put up with our various incarnations, and my eccentricities!
The stuff above is later than the data he used in that link, but it doesn't matter. If you feel that matches your interpretation of fantastic races better, use it!
The one big thing about LAW is that it is a tool set. Make of it what you will! This requires a little more work on the Judge/GameMaster, and adjudication, but as you know everyone house-rules, and LAW is a great groundwork for that (I/We feel).
There are a few other posts around here that make that philosophy clearer. I am always open to suggestions about how to make everything clearer. Maybe we should make a prominent link to them?
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Post by Lord Inar on Mar 1, 2018 11:56:21 GMT -5
Hi all,
I will gladly update with the new data when I get a chance.
Hopefully sooner rather than later! i did some funky stuff with making sure races work to an extent, so i hope I remember what I did.
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Post by Lord Inar on Mar 1, 2018 12:17:55 GMT -5
Hi Brett, A quick analysis to me indicates that the following races seem a bit underpowered compared to others. Tigrans: the claw daggers are nice but are unnecessary if they use any weapon Goblins: have 32 points like most other races but no "extras" Orcs: worst by far with no "extras" AND only 29 pts of attributes
The halfling from my sheet would be: 7/9/8 +8 points. Stealth +1 (more in line with the slightly "weaker" original humans)
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Post by Lord Inar on Mar 7, 2018 11:25:36 GMT -5
Hi Brett, A quick analysis to me indicates that the following races seem a bit underpowered compared to others. Tigrans: the claw daggers are nice but are unnecessary if they use any weapon Goblins: have 32 points like most other races but no "extras" Orcs: worst by far with no "extras" AND only 29 pts of attributes The halfling from my sheet would be: 7/9/8 +8 points. Stealth +1 (more in line with the slightly "weaker" original humans) Just looking for a quick verification that my analysis of the asymmetry among the races was correct.
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Post by platimus on Mar 14, 2018 18:35:20 GMT -5
Hi Brett, A quick analysis to me indicates that the following races seem a bit underpowered compared to others. Tigrans: the claw daggers are nice but are unnecessary if they use any weapon Goblins: have 32 points like most other races but no "extras" Orcs: worst by far with no "extras" AND only 29 pts of attributes The halfling from my sheet would be: 7/9/8 +8 points. Stealth +1 (more in line with the slightly "weaker" original humans) Just looking for a quick verification that my analysis of the asymmetry among the races was correct. Don't know if my 2 cents is worth much but I agree that the Orcs seem a bit underpowered compared to Goblins. I don't understand your objection to Tigran Claws.
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Post by Lord Inar on Mar 20, 2018 11:58:52 GMT -5
I don't understand your objection to Tigran Claws. If I buy a dagger, I am effectively equivalent to a dagger, except in those corner cases where I could be disarmed or don't have a weapon handy. maybe always being armed is a factor to some people, but it's a little weak to me.
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